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  • QQ on ICM spot against the chip leader

    Posted by dachiwaiian on April 5, 2023 at 10:30 pm

    What’s your decision here? You’re the 2nd largest stack with QQ and the chip leader goes all-in ahead of you. WPT DeepStacks Paris, final 5. The chip leader has 36BB, you have 25BB and the other 3 players are at 12-14BB each. Chip leader is on your immediate right and the 3 small stacks are on your left. Payouts: €200K/136K/97K/69K/49K. The final 6 have been playing very tight – nobody has busted in 6-hours. Finally, #6 has busted 10mins prior. Chip leader hasn’t been particularly aggressive but has the highest VPIP at 32% while most of the other players are in the mid-20s. With the chip leader shoving from the Btn, what do you do?

    dachiwaiian replied 10 months, 4 weeks ago 3 Members · 8 Replies
  • 8 Replies
  • fivebyfive

    Administrator
    April 6, 2023 at 9:24 am

    My gut instinct is that this is a call, but barely. But I’m going to run it and report back later.

  • fivebyfive

    Administrator
    April 6, 2023 at 9:39 am

    So if we give our opponent a very wide range. Jamming any Ax, any pair except trapping with AA/KK, and most broadways (around 24%), we can call up to JJ+ (not even AK). If opponent is more reasonable/tighter, this narrows down to KK+

    • dachiwaiian

      Member
      April 6, 2023 at 2:28 pm

      Thanks for this breakdown. Does this take ICM into account? I’m kind of torn. On one hand, the chip leader should be attacking with a pretty wide range, knowing that the hero should not be incentivized to call wide with the 2nd biggest stack with so many short stacks. QQ should do pretty well against a wide range. I also don’t think the chip leader would play AA/KK that way as they should want to get more value from those hands. But the flip side is the hero should not be putting their stack at risk because of those short stacks – even if they knew the chip leaders range from the button was any ace. I just started studying ICM and how the middle stacks should think about tough spots like this, but not sure what I would do with conflicting concepts like this.

      • fivebyfive

        Administrator
        April 6, 2023 at 3:49 pm

        Yes, I entered the stacks and payouts as given, so it is a full accounting of ICM. The only variable is V’s range. If V is a mega-bully, and doing this with the range I explained, we can comfortably call. If V is more nuanced (mixing between raising and shoving), it gets dicey and depends. If V is playing this range with any kind of strength/tightness in their shoving range, KK is the bottom of our calling range. If you want to give me a specific range that you think V is doing this with, I can run it.

  • jim

    Administrator
    April 25, 2023 at 3:04 pm

    wow what a great answer by @FiveByFive – that’s why he’s the guy running the strategy side of the operation around here!

    • dachiwaiian

      Member
      May 5, 2023 at 1:25 pm

      Yes, this has been super helpful. I realize now how important knowing how to use the right tools are. I’ve been studying ICM strategy and this one really had me stumped. When I first watched the video, I thought QQ was an easy call but as I thought about the ICM implications and the presence of the small stacks, I thought it might have been a huge mistake. I went back and forth many times before posting here and this cleared it up.

  • dachiwaiian

    Member
    May 5, 2023 at 1:40 pm

    For those who are results oriented, the hero called and villain showed AK. Board runs out 45A2A and hero is eliminated in 5th place. The commentator was saying that the hero may have made a $80,000 mistake for taking on the big stack with so many small stacks behind. It was unfortunate that he ran into the top of the big stack’s shoving range who then hit their card.

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