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KK Preflop Facing Cold 4-Bet
LearnWPT emailed this spot as a quiz.
It’s a 6-Max $25/$50 cash game on an aggressive table. Effective stacks are about 100bb. This spot could come up early in a tournament as well.
We are in the CO facing a $150 open raise from the HJ. We look down at KK and 3-bet to $450. The BTN, who frequently reraises, cold 4-bets to $1,100. The action folds down to us. What do we do?
My instinct is to jam, as I think most of us would.
But LearnWPT says the pro play is to call here. The postflop plan is to check the flop, hoping to induce our aggressive player to commit with his bluffs, which could be stuff like A5s. We have to be ready to make some tough postflop calls.
What do you think of this strategy given the conditions LearnWPT laid out?
In the games I play, my heart always sinks a little bit facing 4-bets with KK. I always think, here goes my buy-in, he’s got AA. Then I jam. I’ve been snapped with AA alot, but also with AK or QQ. Sometimes they even show up with lower pocket pairs. I’ve gotten a few folds too.
How do you play KK facing 4-bets and cold 4-bets?
Do you think in our lower stakes games/tournaments we should play it the way LearnWPT recommends for this higher stakes aggressive cash game?
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4 Replies
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Agree the cold 4! is a very narrow range and not small pairs or even bluffs very often unless we think V is extremely capable. I think at 100bb I like to put it in out of position but would be OK with a call in position b/c it is easier to play post flop. And yes, we always hang on vs very aggressive players to keep bluffs in. Another thing I think about here is stack sizes. Often the cash games I play in approach 200bb, so at that point I’m less eager to get it in pre-flop and want to get reads on action/sizing/etc. in later streets before getting it in with one pair.
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They don’t bluff enough.
I have 13 instances of getting 4 bet with pocket kings since 2016 with a win rate of 6,282 BB per 100 hands, and an all-in adjusted win rate of
3,722 BB/100.
Sorting for all 196 hands facing a 4bet over the last 5 years, I “only” win
141 all in adjusted BB/100,
(losing every hand when I am in early position). Thanks for helping me find a leak!
Sorting just for hands in 2022, my hand selection is better, but my win rate is down to
-439 all in adjusted BB/100 over 29 hands.
The only hands I have won in a 4bet pot this year are QQ+ and AK.
Out of the 29 hands this year villain 4bet me with, these are their hands.
I folded pre- 2/29. I think I have a problem. 🚉
I folded to the cbet once- very disciplined of me, lol.
AA-3 times
4 bet shove 55BB w/ AA, I called with KK 🤦♂️
I called a 24BB 4bet all in w/ JJ vs their KK
AKo- 3 times
4bet shove 75BB w/ AQo and cold called by pocket 9s
AQo 4bet shove 77BB hit straight
A4s
KK 4bet shoved 99BB
KJo- flopped a set
K4s (3-handed)
TT-2
4bet, then Called 43BB 5bet w/ pocket 8s86s
66 4bet shove 28BB rivered set
4bet shove 25BB w/ 55 and cold called by A9s
Cold call 3bet, 5bet shove 42BB w/ J2s (4bet was AA)
fold to 5bet 1/1
Fold to turn lead 2/2
Call turn probe and shove river 1/1
Cold call BN (99) all in 4bet and won with donk flop with AKo
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Yamel pointed this out, but we’re OOP. If HJ opened, I 3bet with KK from the BTN, and a very aggro SB cold 4-bet, then I’d very much consider calling. But in this formation, I personally hate it. There seems to be an assumption that this villain will mindlessly bluff off their entire stack regardless of runout, but I don’t think that is the case in practice, even with aggro preflop players. In fact, I think there is a specific player type that is aggro pre and passive post, and we better be absolutely sure this player isn’t that before we employ this play.
If we do just call in this spot, we’re doing this exploitively because we think they will barrel off. So then we almost can never fold, right? We’re just ck-calling the whole way down, even on A-high boards? Seems sketchy since we’re hoping to catch them with A5s. If we jam, we get to clean up equity from folds and take down a big pot without any chance of losing. So what if Ah5h folds when we jam? We get to clean up their 30% equity that they would retain if we let them see the flop. And when we are called, as long as they’re calling with hands like QQ and AK, we have great odds. I’m jamming.
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5-bet jamming here is never a bad play but it makes our hand face up and we should be willing to flat a % of the time, especially with a 100 bb starting stack and vs. described hyper aggro villain.
Our SPR will be less than 2-1 on the flop so there are lots of ways to get it in post-flop. We can C/R flop or check/call likely flop and turn (or river) 2-barrels from the V. If we do take this line, however, I don’t think we can fold any textures including vs. an ace on the board.
I prefer a mixed strategy with KK/AA vs. hyper aggro 4-bet. Always 5-betting is a mistake IMO.
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